E15 being pushed into fueling stations
#1
07-06-2011 | 07:16 PM
E15 being pushed into fueling stations
The automobile industry has responded to a rule authorized by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) that allows E15 fuel � 85 percent gasoline, 15 percent ethanol � to be sold at gas stations across the country. In short: the response is anything but supportive.
Car manufacturers like Ford, BMW, Toyota and Honda, expressed disapproval of the E15 mixture intended to help ween the industry off foreign oil. Their responses were just made public Tuesday afternoon.
Almost all of the companies� qualms are based on the fact that E15 would do irreparable damage to cars made before 2001 and using the new ethanol fuel would violate many of the warranties they issue for their vehicles.
In her letter to Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner of Wisconsin, Vice Chair of the House Science Committee, Susan Clsohke, Group Vice President at Ford Motor Compan,y said they do �not support the introduction of E15 into the marketplace for the legacy fleet.�� The letter also said that �fuel not approved in the owner�s manual is considered misfueling and any damage resulting from misfueling is not covered by the warranty.��
Thomas Baloga, Vice President of Engineering for BMW in the U.S., wrote a letter to Sensenbrenner saying, that �BMW Group engines and fuel supply systems can be damaged by misfueling with E15.�� Baloga also added that �damage appears in the form of very rapid corrosion of fuel pump parts, rapid formation of sludge in the oil pan, plugged filters, and other damage that is very costly to the vehicle owner.��
Toyota had similar concerns. �Toyota cannot recommend the use of fuel with greater than E10 for Toyota vehicles currently on the road,�� wrote Thomas Lehner, Vice President of Government and Industry Affairs. �Our policy remains that we will not provide warranty coverage for issues arising from the misuse of fuels that exceed specified limits.�� (Inhofe letter asks why EPA requests $1.24 billion in new funding, despite $2 billion on hand)
Other companies that reacted to the E15 mix include Chrysler, Mercedes-Benz, Mazda, Nissan, Volkswagen, Volvo, Hyundai, and Kia.
Volkswagen even went after the EPA by name, writing that the agency, �did not conduct an adequate test program when E15 was considered and then approved for use in conventional vehicles.��
�It is hard to understand why EPA is pushing a fuel that can void a car�s warranty, lower its MPG, harm older vehicles, and cause confusion at the pump,�� Richard Russell, who was Deputy Director for Technology in the Office of Science and Technology Policy in the Bush Administration, told The Daily Caller.
�It seems as if the EPA hasn�t really considered the impact of its support for corn-based E15 on consumers,�� Russell added.
That confusion at the pump, some say, will come when unsuspecting consumers accidentally fill their gas tanks with E15 fuel only to find out their vehicle can�t handle the high ethanol content.
To combat that, the EPA has approved a warning label that will be placed on pumps selling E15, cautioning drivers to only use E15 in 2001 or newer models. The label also says that using E15 in the wrong engines is now literally a federal offense.
By all accounts the E15 fuel appears to be a case of politics trumping science, or at least, politics trumping industry wishes.
�Americans need a fuel that will give them more miles out of a gallon of gas and extend the lives of their cars�not one that will prematurely send their vehicles to the junkyard,�� said Sensenbrenner in a statement. �The EPA is pursuing its own political agenda at the expense of American consumers. I have contacted EPA Administrator Lisa Jackson with these responses, and given the negligible environmental benefits, I await her defense of this unwise decision.��
On Thursday, the House Science, Space, and Technology Committee/s Energy and Environment Subcommittee will hold a hearing examining the science of E15.
Read more: EPA fuel | oppose | The Daily Caller
Cliffs
1: EPA approves %15 ethanol gas to be sold all across the country
2: many automobile manufactures strongly disagree
3: It is harmful for many engines especially those produced before 2001
Now, not only is it harmful to engines (for additional reasons to what was listed in the article) but its not efficient at all in the sense of producing it and burning it as a fuel. Now that the state of Iowa is addicted to the governments subsidies its going to be a pain to reverse this ****.
Car manufacturers like Ford, BMW, Toyota and Honda, expressed disapproval of the E15 mixture intended to help ween the industry off foreign oil. Their responses were just made public Tuesday afternoon.
Almost all of the companies� qualms are based on the fact that E15 would do irreparable damage to cars made before 2001 and using the new ethanol fuel would violate many of the warranties they issue for their vehicles.
In her letter to Rep. Jim Sensenbrenner of Wisconsin, Vice Chair of the House Science Committee, Susan Clsohke, Group Vice President at Ford Motor Compan,y said they do �not support the introduction of E15 into the marketplace for the legacy fleet.�� The letter also said that �fuel not approved in the owner�s manual is considered misfueling and any damage resulting from misfueling is not covered by the warranty.��
Thomas Baloga, Vice President of Engineering for BMW in the U.S., wrote a letter to Sensenbrenner saying, that �BMW Group engines and fuel supply systems can be damaged by misfueling with E15.�� Baloga also added that �damage appears in the form of very rapid corrosion of fuel pump parts, rapid formation of sludge in the oil pan, plugged filters, and other damage that is very costly to the vehicle owner.��
Toyota had similar concerns. �Toyota cannot recommend the use of fuel with greater than E10 for Toyota vehicles currently on the road,�� wrote Thomas Lehner, Vice President of Government and Industry Affairs. �Our policy remains that we will not provide warranty coverage for issues arising from the misuse of fuels that exceed specified limits.�� (Inhofe letter asks why EPA requests $1.24 billion in new funding, despite $2 billion on hand)
Other companies that reacted to the E15 mix include Chrysler, Mercedes-Benz, Mazda, Nissan, Volkswagen, Volvo, Hyundai, and Kia.
Volkswagen even went after the EPA by name, writing that the agency, �did not conduct an adequate test program when E15 was considered and then approved for use in conventional vehicles.��
�It is hard to understand why EPA is pushing a fuel that can void a car�s warranty, lower its MPG, harm older vehicles, and cause confusion at the pump,�� Richard Russell, who was Deputy Director for Technology in the Office of Science and Technology Policy in the Bush Administration, told The Daily Caller.
�It seems as if the EPA hasn�t really considered the impact of its support for corn-based E15 on consumers,�� Russell added.
That confusion at the pump, some say, will come when unsuspecting consumers accidentally fill their gas tanks with E15 fuel only to find out their vehicle can�t handle the high ethanol content.
To combat that, the EPA has approved a warning label that will be placed on pumps selling E15, cautioning drivers to only use E15 in 2001 or newer models. The label also says that using E15 in the wrong engines is now literally a federal offense.
By all accounts the E15 fuel appears to be a case of politics trumping science, or at least, politics trumping industry wishes.
�Americans need a fuel that will give them more miles out of a gallon of gas and extend the lives of their cars�not one that will prematurely send their vehicles to the junkyard,�� said Sensenbrenner in a statement. �The EPA is pursuing its own political agenda at the expense of American consumers. I have contacted EPA Administrator Lisa Jackson with these responses, and given the negligible environmental benefits, I await her defense of this unwise decision.��
On Thursday, the House Science, Space, and Technology Committee/s Energy and Environment Subcommittee will hold a hearing examining the science of E15.
Read more: EPA fuel | oppose | The Daily Caller
Cliffs
1: EPA approves %15 ethanol gas to be sold all across the country
2: many automobile manufactures strongly disagree
3: It is harmful for many engines especially those produced before 2001
Now, not only is it harmful to engines (for additional reasons to what was listed in the article) but its not efficient at all in the sense of producing it and burning it as a fuel. Now that the state of Iowa is addicted to the governments subsidies its going to be a pain to reverse this ****.
#2
07-06-2011 | 08:17 PM
Super Moderator
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 8,725
From: Alaska
Yeah I really am getting sick of this stuff. Lets keep adding stuff to cars that make them run worse just because its "environmentally friendly" or gets us off foreign oil.
Between the EGR valve putting exhaust gas back in, the PCV valve putting oil back in, and ethanol in the gas tank, we are just putting a damper on our engines.
Between the EGR valve putting exhaust gas back in, the PCV valve putting oil back in, and ethanol in the gas tank, we are just putting a damper on our engines.
#3
07-06-2011 | 10:23 PM
Yeah I really am getting sick of this stuff. Lets keep adding stuff to cars that make them run worse just because its "environmentally friendly" or gets us off foreign oil.
Between the EGR valve putting exhaust gas back in, the PCV valve putting oil back in, and ethanol in the gas tank, we are just putting a damper on our engines.
Between the EGR valve putting exhaust gas back in, the PCV valve putting oil back in, and ethanol in the gas tank, we are just putting a damper on our engines.
when i had my 05 impala 3400, they made a egr delete. are these not avaliable?
#7
07-26-2011 | 04:20 PM
I have taken the EGR off my Mitsubishi Pajero 1992 2.5 TD and blanket it off. the result is, I get no black smoke and my revs gone up, and saves me cleaning the dump thing every year!
Unfortunately, on the later models (1997 and later), you can't blank EGR as the pump is electronic!
EGR a bad idea for Europe.
Unfortunately, on the later models (1997 and later), you can't blank EGR as the pump is electronic!
EGR a bad idea for Europe.
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